Benzos aren't helping

Hi all. I'm 34. I've had major depression and GAD all my life, only just taken bull by the horns over last 12 months. I stopped drink and speed 5 years ago and so have no current addictions that effect my illness.
Effexor and propanolol are helping wonderfully, but I cant sleep.
When first prescribed sleep meds about 6 months ago(mogadon) it worked for a while but then would just knock me out for two hours and I'd be wide awake again.
Currently using xanax as an anti anxiety defense if I have bad attack. Also valium which was meant to just initially help me relax at night but now isn't doing much.
I'm aware of the whole benzo culture, so I dont need a lecture. I've only increased my prescribed dose by double but it still hasn't helped with relaxation.
It's at the stage where they're not really doing what they were prescribed for so I'm not about to start taking more and more to counteract. As it is my psych has me tapering off the valium anyway. Which I'm not really fazed about anyway coz its not putting me to sleep. I just keep xanax on standby for when I feel like smashing my head through walls.
I'm at a loss and I dont know if i'm being paranoid that my docs aren't telling me about other meds coz of my past drug abuse history. I am different now and will never resort to illicit drugs again, but coz I'm paranoid I dont know if they really believe me.
Is there anything else that can be prescribed for sleep and relaxation, even just in the short term as I need to reastablish a pattern as I'm meant to be returning to work in 3 months, after a long break after a bad breakdown.
I've come a long way for the better but if I cant get sleep it all goes #@$%&*in insane and I can feel it starting to spiral man.
My psych talked about some antipsychotic meds that we could try, but because I'm not actually clinically psychotic he would have to list me as such, which he said he could do anyway. Any one know much about this stuff?
I exercise, I eat well, Ive got support, I live with a very understanding girlfriend, I have a dog i love, social life is slowly begginning again. Sleep is nowhere. Its like its the last part of the puzzle thats been lost and so the picture remains incomplete.
Any medications that helped you?
Thanks for reading.

I'm sorry you're having trouble sleeping. My suggestion would be to have a Sleep Study. Then you can know exactly why you're not sleeping well. Ask your psych to refer you to a Sleep Doctor. Good luck!

Thanks for quick reply. Awesome mate.
I'd never really heard of a sleep study until I looked around on these forums, I'm surprised my psych didn't mention it. Mind you I have only seen an actual psychiatrist for 3 sessions. In aus we get 12 sessions covered by medicare if the psych agrees your case is legit.
I will look further into this, although maybe it will be hard to get a natural assessment with all these medications all over the place? Or is that me just being negative again.man. Stomp. I gotta stop that.
Thanks for feedback bronxgirl. happy days man!

Hi Jamie,
I take seroquel for more than just sleep, but if I take it correctly (same time every night) it does regulate my sleep. I believe benzo's at least certain ones are stronger though.
I think its temazepam (xyrem might be another name for it) that is supposed to knock you right out & then you take it again after 4hours or something like that. I wouldn't know 1st hand bc they don't give me the good stuff like benzodiazepines & amphetamines.
Hope that helps

lyman

Chris - the medication you mentioned is Xyrem. I take it - it really helps! I take my first dose before I go to bed, and then the second dose 4 hours later. I get 8 hours of sleep each night!

Jamie - if you can have a Sleep Study, that would be great! When I had my Sleep Studies, I was able to take my meds. It didn't interfere with the study. See if your psych doctor will refer you for one. Good luck!

Ok so I got some stilnox and it put me out for about 4 hours.
I dont see my psychiatrist for 6 weeks man! His family is ill and he is in india. My gp is also hesitant to take any other significant steps until we are able to confer with psych. So looks like a sleep study might be a while yet.
I have just this week started psychotherapy counselling with a psychologist who seems like a nice man. It might take a bit to let the guard down tho.
It was just after I saw him that I had a four day panic flip with no sleep and suicidal thoughts, not direct ones, but the bottles of benzos were starting to look tasty. I called lifeline and they talked me thru it. My girlfriend took my meds and is helping me. I'm not gonna let addiction #@$%&* my life again. Clean five years and just this week felt the weakness clawing at my mind. Just to take a dozen or so valium might of relaxed me. I had to fight it and lost my mind temporarily.
It felt like I was comin down hard and my old track was itchy and my emotions were bouncing from emptiness to hate to loss to hunger for drugs to nothing and surreal nothingness.
I've never felt that since when I craved a hit, and it scared the #@$%&* out of me. I felt dirty. I felt like a criminal. I felt like the scum of the earth. I felt like all my hardwork was for #@$%&*all.
Got thru it. But I still cant work out what triggered it. This is the scary part.
I just wanted the numb. The nod. You know, the easy way out.
Any way, much clearer now, and it feels good to have written this down. I fought it and I won.
Still not sleeping soundly tho. Stilnox not really knockin me out. I'm scared i might reach for these benzos. I gotta stay strong. I just gotta sleep.

Jamie - you are NOT a bad person. You might have thought about taking the pills - but you didn't. That is good! You got through it. Congratulations!!!!

Perhaps you felt panicked because you started seeing a psychologist and you had to talk to him and let your guard down. Does that sound possible to you? And again - you got through it okay and now your head is clear. You did good!

I hope you'll let your new psychologist know what happened and how you felt.

Jamie,

I was clean 14yrs & blew it! I lost everything; my wife, my career & distanced my family that had to painfully watch me go through hell for 10 to 12yrs wondering if I was going to survive or end up locked up forever. The docs say that its normal for BP type 1 thing to hit in the late 20's to early 30's. I'm 43 now.

My ass had to be whooped enough & ALL forms of self medicating had to stop working before I could accept that I had ANY kind of mental illness. I'm one of those people that has an extremely difficult time asking for help or even just admitting that I need it to begin with!

I've been clean for 9mos here in Utah but if I go back to Oakland, CA I know I'll smoke weed again. It did work for a few years...problem is that it lead to drinking & other drugs. I still have a hard time w/the pot thing. I was growing it commercially.

Its hard for me to get in trouble here in Orem. I got diagnosed w/BP @ the psych ward (Uni) then went to Cirque Lodge for help w/the poly substance abuse issues. I'm currently developing friendships w/some of the people I met during my 74day stay in Donnie Osmond's old changing room.

Your post gave me hope & inspiration to stay strong bc I won't be able to learn how to live w/my BP1 dx if I break down & start smoking weed again. I found some O.C.'s on the floor @ a local coffee shop & was able to NOT take them...I still wonder how I didn't! BUT I'm so grateful. I tell myself to give it @ least a year of listening to the doctors.

After all I did my best to try & fix myself! My brain likes to believe that manic is "normal". Not this "baseline" crap... SO dull. Its been hard getting used to. I've got to learn how to have fun all over again.

Got any tips? Maybe it would be a good topic for a new thread

lyman

Gday Lyman how ya doin?

When I read your story I felt some things ring true. The fact that you found some drugs and didn't take them is an absolute huge achievement. This in itself is a memory you should never forget. I can imagine it must have been hard at that moment but never forget you beat the temptation.
When I went cold turkey from everything I turned my addiction to weight lifting. I do not use steroids and never will. I am an addict and so will always need something to have my idle hands occupied or else I get bored very easily. Lifting weights and structuring my life around this, ie diet, casual gym acquaintences etc is how I control my time and energy. I have found certain forums online that I use to talk to people about things not regarding my mental health. The good thing about positive forums is that because I suffer chronic social anxiety I am able to communicate with people when I need to without putting myself in self destructive situations.
I don't know your lifestyle or if you have a partner or a job. Physical activity really is a huge key to staying in control. Also I dont know if you like animals, but I have a dog that I love. When I was living alone and suffering through the hardest times my dog was there with me. people need to express their good feelings aswell as their bad. Just walking my dog and giving him a pat is truly rewarding. He has helped me. I now live with my girlfriend and she is understanding of the bond I have with "mans best friend"
From reading the brief message you wrote mate I can sense positivity and also hear that you are searching for ways to get through it. This means you will get through it.
At the end of the day, no amount of clinics or rehab can do what you yourself can do. You have the inner strength. Nobody else, just you.
And, you're doin it man.
I wish you all the best Lyman. Stay clean. Stay strong.
If I think of anything else I'll post.
Feel free to shout out anytime you need to vent mate.
If it ever gets real heavy just jump and run and scream and flail your arms until you're stuffed.
Keep up the good work bro

Stay strong
Jamie

Congratulations Jamie & Chris on resisting your addiction urges!!!

25mg Seroquel is the only sleep med of the many that I have tried that worked for me. It triggered INSANE binge eating in me though so I had to discontinue it.

If racing thoughts are keeping your brain from shutting off, do some research on the supplement GABA. That is my main sleep aid now and my sleep is more regular and refreshing than it has been in my entire life. But I also take melatonin, calcium and magnesium which are also calming.

K

Gday K, thanks for positive reply. Hope you're doing well!

Do you weight train? I notice you take some supplements associated with muscular repair.
I actually recently stumbled by chance upon a site selling GABA. Is it really a good sleep aid? I've read that it can also assist in the release of hormones conducive to positive results with weight training.
Magnesium and zinc are apparently also effective in this area. Any experience?
I tried some magnesium tabs but found they didn't really help relax or sleep at all. Even when used in the exact manner as per instructed.
How's your sleep these days?

Thanks mate
Jamie

My problem has been that I sleep TOO MUCH lately...Like 12 and 13 hours at a time. But I have some experience with sleeping medications.

First there are benzodiazepines. Valium and Xanax are generally not prescribed for sleep but for anxiety. Other benzos such as temazepam (Restoril) are more typically prescribed for sleep. Honestly, seeing as you have a history of addiction...I'm surprised that your psychiatrist prescribed these. Shrinks are more reluctant to prescribe benzos to addicts. (I fall in this boat too...I've got just 76 days since my last drink.)

There are non-benzodiazepine sleep aides which act similar to the benzos but are slightly different structurally. They can still be habit forming. This includes drugs like Ambien.

Then there are drugs which are technically not designed as sleep aides, but which often produce sedation as a side effect. These drugs can include antidepressants (Trazodone) and anti-psychotics (Respiridone, Seroquel). These drugs are not generally habit-forming, making them safer for addicts to take...However they can have many unintended side effects.

There are OTC drugs used for sleep...Generally these drugs are just diphenhydramine (Benadryl). It's cheaper to buy generic Benadryl or allergy medication than sleep medication...It's the same drug, but cheaper.

Finally there are herbal/supplements. Melatonin is sometimes useful. Some people claim that valerian helps with sleep. I've also heard claims that passionflower can help.

hi Evolence , beautiful name by the way

I have tried all of your suggestions to no avail. OTC antihistimines knock me out but turn me into a big bad wolf the next day so I avoid using them.

The only thing I haven't tried are the anti psychotic meds. My shrink actually suggested that we could try these if my problem continued. I was due to see him last week but he has been called away overseas due to family illness and now I cant see him for another month!

My gp is a good guy but obviously doesn't want to prescribe antipsychotics as he understands I am working closely with my shrink and does not see it right to interfere, which I can understand and actually think is good. We've got it set up where my shrink tells me what to take and i go get the script from my gp, This way there can be no accidental over prescribing which makes complete sense. Being an addict off the #@$%&* for 5 years I appreciate this plan.

As I am not actually "clinically psychotic" my shrink said we could still try antipsychotic drugs but he would have to list me as "psychotic", which I think would be ok if it helps me get better.I would also have to stop taking my propranalol, which in my opinion has helped my violent urges.

It all gets a bit confusing, being borderline this and borderline that and having no real category to fall into. I am diagnosed Major Deppressive and General and Social Anxiety Disorder.

Could you tell me a bit about your experiences with the antipsychotics. Finding real info on the net can be frustrating, you know like the companies and doctors dont wanna let you in on the secrets or something (possible paranoia).

Thanks heaps
Jamie

Hi Jamie,

No I don't weight train but I do maintain muscle easy with limited exercise. The GABA has been the single biggest improvement to my regular sleep. Instead of swinging between 3 to 16 hours per night. I get between 6 to 10 hours nearly every night since starting the GABA. My body is so adjusted to my routine that I can even go a night or 2 without taking anything and still sleep at least 5 hours.

Magnesium alone I doubt would ever be enough for someone with serious sleep issues, but it is a piece of the puzzle I wouldn't ignore.

Zinc too is a piece of the puzzle that not only supports the immune system but also helps with depression which can also interfere with sleep.

Finding the right supplement combo is even more complicated than finding the right prescription combo, but if you do your research and know your own body well, there are usually fewer harmful side effects. But there is no magic pill that will cure us overnight.

Jamie - I saw what you wrote about possibly trying anti-psychotics. I have been taking them for about 4 years now. They seem to be working - once I tried to go off of them and it was a bad idea. I take Risperidone. The only side effect that I had was weight gain. But now that I'm taking Xyrem for sleep, I have lost weight.

Anyway, the Risperidone works well for me. It keeps me from being "crazy" - I am much calmer on it. Anyway, that is my experience.

Hey K
Thanks for response. I hear ya on the natural supplementation being gold over scripts, but at the moment I am happier than I've been so I dont wanna risk changing that.
Now it's just working out a healthier sleep pattern. Actually got a good sleep last night. Sometimes your mind just throws in the towel and says ok you win and lets your body relax.
All the best
Jamie


Hey Bronxgirl

I looked into the xyrem as a sleep med, but to be honest I'm not even sure if it's available in australia, which is where I am. Isn't it supposed to be the hardest script to obtain? Not sure if my psych would prescribe it to me coz of past drug abuse?

Happy days
Jamie

Thanks everyone

Jamie - it is very hard to get Xyrem. It's a controlled substance. I have a past history of Xanax abuse, but my doctors felt that Xyrem is a good fit for me. I had tried all of the other sleep meds, but they didn't work. I was desperate! So with a diagnosis of Narcolepsy, I am able to get the Xyrem.

I have taken Seroquel once or twice in a hospital setting. And I have taken Respiridone for well over a year. Both drugs initially produce a lot of sedation. When I was in the hospital, they gave me respiridone during the day...And I'd be knocked out napping for hours on end. I switched my doses so that I now take it at night. This used to lead to me sleeping soundly through the night. However, with time my body has gotten more acclimated to the drug...So often I will take the drug late at night, but still I'll be up for several hours into the night. (They've also reduced my dose by 30% over the past few months). Respiridone produces a nice state for me...It seems to even out the highs and lows for me...And it keeps the negative internal dialogue quieter. I've read reports that people hate respiridone because it makes them feel dead and empty inside. I guess these people were not psychotic, because the drug has never made me feel negatively.